|[||Tags|||||bsd, bsdl, free, freenode, gpl, irc, lgpl, open, people talking on irc, software, source||]|
|||||Yehuda Poliker - They Were Dancing Barefoot.||]|
This is an IRC conversation that took place on Freenode. I am "rindolf".
<bogdan> rindolf: so you like being selfish, eh?
<bogdan> and you wanted to find a reason to be selfish.
<rindolf> bogdan: http://xrl.us/h2kn
<rindolf> bogdan: Rand made a mistake by naming her book "The virtue
<rindolf> bogdan: she didn't mean it in the sense of "Complete
disrespect for others".
<spectei> GPL > BSD
<rindolf> spectei: GPL is more selfish.
<Dianora_> BSD > GPL
<rindolf> Dianora_: :-)
<Dianora_> BSD is free, GPL is not free.
<rindolf> Dianora_: not you too.
<rindolf> spectei: the BSD is free, even Stallman thinks so.
<Dianora_> The GPL is like finding a coupon for $20 for pants on the
street, the BSDL is like finding a $20 bill on the street.
<Dianora_> I would rather have the $20 bill
<rindolf> Dianora_: please lets agree to accept Stallman's definition
of Freedom, and call BSD-style licensed software by another
<rindolf> Dianora_: I don't see the anlogy.
<Dianora_> even esr prefers the BSDL
<rindolf> Dianora_: yes, I know.
<rindolf> That's what I use for my software.
<rindolf> If I can help it.
<Dianora_> No Stallmans version of Freedom is a political
mis-labelling of true freedom.
<rindolf> Dianora_: I'm not saying he defined freedom.
<rindolf> Dianora_: but he coined the term "free softwae
<Dianora_> He can try to relabel English anyway he wants, but he is
not taking my language from me.
<rindolf> Dianora_: but different things mean different things in
<rindolf> Dianora_: you can call BSD-style software PD-software or
<rindolf> Dianora_: they are nutjobs.
<rindolf> But they are good people.
<rindolf> They're on our side.
<Dianora_> BSD is FREE, GPL is a restrictive license, that is NOT free
* rindolf is a nutjob but tries to be a good person.
<rindolf> Dianora_: fine. The GPL is not free.
<spectei> it is free software!
<rindolf> "I want to be there, I want to be there".
<pnbeast> GPL is, in fact, a very non-restrictive license.
<rindolf> "fine you are there."
<Dianora_> No, it is NOT free software, the GPL is a restrictive
<rindolf> "danny! What are you doing here?"
<spectei> Dianora_, it is free software as defined by the FSF
<rindolf> "Here? <crying"
<Dianora_> it restricts your right to use that software!
<rindolf> "did I say something wrong?"
<spectei> Dianora_, in a good way!
<rindolf> It's from Sesame street.
<Dianora_> the FSF can label black as white and I will still not
<rindolf> Dianora_: the GPL is better than the MS EULA.
<Dianora_> rindolf yes ;-)
<rindolf> Dianora_: I've contributed to GPL software, and I cannot
<rindolf> Or windows.
<Dianora_> don't get me wrong, I use GPL software, I write in a couple
of GPL projects, but I disagree that GPL is free.
<rindolf> Or Excel.
<rindolf> Dianora_: like I said if we want to communicate we have to
agree on a terminology.
<Dianora_> then the GPL is just that, the GPL a restrictive license.
<pnbeast> I won't argue "free", but I can't imagine how you think the
GPL is restrictive. Can you explain that to me?
<rindolf> Most people accept the fact that free software is software
by the FSF FS definition.
<Dianora_> I am afraid you would be wrong
<Dianora_> available source code yes, but free? uh no. never.
<rindolf> Let's avoid the term free software.
<rindolf> Let's call it open-source.
<Dianora_> as I said, GPL is like a $20 coupon
<rindolf> Dianora_: do you think the GPL is not open-source?
<Dianora_> open-source is a good compromise.
<rindolf> Dianora_: ok.
<rindolf> Free software can also mean gratis software.
<rindolf> And the GPL is sourceware.
<Dianora_> you could have sourcecode that was not licensed to be
changed or used by anyone else, but is available to be
<rindolf> Dianora_: I hope you're not using qmail.
<Dianora_> in fact, everyones favourite whipping boy licenses his code
<Dianora_> I'd use qmail if it was the best tool for the job, no
matter what I thought of djb
<spectei> opensource doesn't mean anything!
<Dianora_> Disliking a person is no reason not to use someones code.
<rindolf> Dianora_: http://www.shlomifish.org/open-source/anti/qmail/
<spectei> dan bernstein is a wacko!
<Dianora_> djb does not allow his code to be modified ;-)
<rindolf> Dianora_: I find Theo objectionable but at least OpenBSD is
<Dianora_> naw, I will make up my own mind thankyouverymuch.
<rindolf> So I can take it , fork it, etc.
<rindolf> Dianora_: I cannot with DJB's software.
<Dianora_> OpenBSD is open-source *FREE* code
<Dianora_> *correct* both DJB and GPL are open-source but both are
<rindolf> Dianora_: and I'm not saying it just because I dislike DJB.
Although due to the qmail licensing it is a problem.
<spectei> GPL is free :D
<Dianora_> gosh, you made my point for me. restricted licenses.
<rindolf> Dianora_: qmail is sourceware not opensource.
<Dianora_> naw rindolf
<rindolf> Dianora_: have you read the OSD.
<rindolf> Or reveled source, or available source, or whatever.
<Dianora_> we both agreed that when you could look at the source, it
was open-source no?
<rindolf> Dianora_: no.
<rindolf> Dianora_: open source is software that complies with OSD or
<rindolf> Preferably both.
<Dianora_> but both GPL and DJB's license are restricted use. ;-)
<pnbeast> Come on, Dianora_, won't you define "restricted" for me?
<Dianora_> the OSD or FSD can call black white and I will still not
use their definition. ;-)
<rindolf> Dianora_: yes, but the GPL is more usable than the DJB
<Dianora_> pnbeast: you are defining it yourself.
<rindolf> Dianora_: I can fork GPLed code.
<rindolf> And I can link against an LGPLed library.
<rindolf> But I cannot fork DJB's code.
<Dianora_> rindolf: doesn't matter! it's still restricted!
<rindolf> Dianora_: it is restricted, yes.
<Dianora_> in fact
<spectei> Dianora_, bad things are restricted!
<rindolf> Dianora_: but it's not black and white.
<pnbeast> I guess that's a "no".
<Dianora_> the BSDL _is_ also restricted
<spectei> closed source proprietary software is bad
<Dianora_> pnbeast: You defined it yourself
<spectei> ergo it is good that it is restricted
<spectei> one can be free and not free to poison a well
<Dianora_> GPL poisons wells
<spectei> it keeps software free!
<Dianora_> GPL is a virus.
<rindolf> Dianora_: Windows < DJB < GPL < LGPL < BSD